No products in the basket.
- This topic has 9 replies, 6 voices, and was last updated 5 years, 1 month ago by
.
Viewing 10 posts - 1 through 10 (of 10 total)
- Posts
Remember the old saying: Trick me once shame on you, trick me twice shame on me.
My F & M in law: He has been in a home for 3 years now and his LW&T is bust except for 20K as allowed. The rest of his money has gone to the care home.
M in law is still independant. But it looks like the norm nowerday to end up in a home and for effectivly the state to use most of your life savings to pay for your care.
I think M in law should get rid of her pile of cash except for 20K and with her state and generious F/S pension still be comfortable.
But how to get rid of her cash? would the state go looking for her missing K’s if she does not go into a care home for say 3 years.
This may help Keith:
Then there is this:
From the same source, how to find and access a care home Assessment:
This is a subject that concerns me directly, as my 89 yo brother is severely affected by dementia, is totally incontinent and does not know his wife, 6 kids, any of the grandkids and Gt-grandkids he loved, or me, which is heartbreaking. His 88 yo wife is a SIL who has always been more like a Big Sis to me and she is now very frail, but refuses to have him placed in a Nursing Home. I have tried to advise her daughters to go for some form of legal advice to overrule mum, but they won’t go against mum’s wishes, although 4 of the 5 are retired themselves. Their brother my nephew supports my point, but has never won any argument against the girls, who are a tight bunch ruled by their 68 yo sister.
Hope the links help, this situation is only going to get worse with an ageing population. At 73 and with serious health issues, I might very well expect to be in the same situation within a decade. So we are considering a few really good holidays!
Good luck with your in-laws Keith.
When the Thought Police arrive at your door, think -
I'm out.I was listening to a programme along these lines recently – similar circumstances where ‘person’ was likely to end up in a care home and had too much money.
The disposal of your assets to avoid / evade care home fees i.e. to bring it under £20K or £23K could be construed by the authorities as a deliberate attempt to dispose of your assets to reduce / avoid the fees and from my understanding can be claimed back.
Having work done on the house, giving the relatives ££s could be seen as such an attempt. However I also heard that the local authority need to discuss with the relative as to how they arrive at any assessment concerning the fees that have to be paid – or at least that is how I understood it.
The more you meet people the more you understand why Noah took animals instead of humans
I remembered this topic when I just got a report from Which called Gifting Assets – what are the rules.
It’s in pdf format, but I’m not sure how to attach it to this post. I’ll post this and try to add it on an edit. If not I’ll copy and paste it to another post.
I tried, but will post afresh.?
Book a family holiday to Los Vegas. say she lost the lot on the tables.
Or tell her to sail round the world and have one last blow out, while being waited on hand and foot. She earnt it, she paid in the pot all her life, spend it.
Gifting assets: what are the rules?
We explain the rules and legal implications of gifting assets, and transferring property, including the deliberate deprivation of assets.
Repercussions of gifting assetsÂ
The cost of care – residential care homes and nursing homes in particular – can be very high, so it’s understandable that some people might be tempted to ‘offload’ assets so that they’re excluded from the financial assessment.You might think that ways to reduce assets could include:
·       gifting money or expensive items, such as a piece of jewellery that has recently been purchased, to family members or close friends
·       putting money into a trust or tying it up in some other way
·       spending out on extravagant holidays
·       gifting property by transferring it into someone else’s name
·       selling an asset, such as a property, to someone for less than its true worth.
But be warned – there are serious implications to ‘gifting assets’ in these ways, for both the person giving away the assets and the person receiving them. Here, we explain the rules for gifting assets, the consequences of doing this incorrectly and the legal implications of transferring property.
Gifting assets and a financial assessment
If your capital (savings and assets) is worth more than the following thresholds, you won’t be eligible for local authority funding and will have to pay for your own care.
·       £23,250 in England and Northern Ireland
·       £26,250 in Scotland
·       £24,000 for home care and £40,000 for a care home in Wales
This will also be the case if you have a weekly income that’s high enough to cover your care fees.
For many people, their home is likely to be their most valuable asset. So it’s not unheard of for people to consider ‘gifting’ their property or other assets when facing the residential care financial assessment.
There are, however, strict rules that local authorities will pay close attention to when carrying out a financial assessment, so you may find it useful to get extra advice about this.
Deliberate deprivation of assets
Deliberate deprivation of assets is when the local authority deems that a person has deliberately disposed of assets to increase eligibility for local authority funding.
When a local authority carries out a financial assessment for residential care it will ask about previously-owned assets, not just those that are owned currently. Remember that with a property, it’s quite easy for the authorities to check the ownership ‘trail’.
This might include giving away (gifting) assets, as well as other courses of action, such as selling an asset for less than its true value. For example, there have been cases of people ‘selling’ houses to a relative for a nominal fee such as £10, just so that they can transfer the legal ownership. If avoiding care costs is considered to be a significant factor in the reasoning behind the disposal, then it may be considered a deprivation of assets.
When might disposal of assets be defined as ‘deliberate’?
ÂWhen deciding if deprivation was ‘deliberate’ the local authority might look at the following aspects.
·       Motive/intention: when disposing of assets, was the main reason to avoid care charges?
·       Timing: there is no set time limit, although local authorities are unlikely to investigate too far back. Most importantly, they will look at the time between the person realising that they needed care and the disposing of assets.
·       Amount: was the gift a significant amount that would make a difference to your capital limit? The asset would have to be worth a significant amount for the local authority to pursue this action. Giving away a £300,000 property, for example, would significantly affect your total capital whereas smaller ‘gifts’ – such as giving a £300 ring to a granddaughter – are unlikely to prompt further investigation.
It all boils down to intention. When you made the gift, could you have reasonably known that you might need care? For example, if you fell ill, were assessed as needing residential care, then signed your property over to a relative the following week, that would look suspiciously like ‘deliberate deprivation’.
Non-deliberate deprivation of assets
Of course, not all disposals of assets are necessarily deliberate deprivation – it might have nothing to do with care, especially if there was no consideration of paying for the cost of care at that time.
·       You might want to give tax-free sums of money to children or grandchildren, so that you can enjoy seeing them spend it and to avoid Inheritance Tax.
·       You might also want to help family members who are struggling financially or splash out on a well-deserved ‘holiday of a lifetime’.
·       If you went on an extravagant cruise while you were still in good health and had no idea that you would need care, this might simply be regarded a post-retirement treat.
Notional capital
Giving away capital can therefore have serious consequences. If a person is found to have ‘deliberately deprived’ themselves of assets, the value of these assets can still be taken into account in the financial assessment, even though they no longer own them.
The value of the assets that they used to have is called ‘notional capital’. The value of a person’s notional capital can be added to their remaining assets to form their total financial assets for the financial assessment. So, in the example of transferring ownership of your home, not only could you end up having to pay for your care, you might no longer have a house to fund those costs.
Powers of recovery
If the local authority funds someone’s residential care costs and later rules that a person has ‘deliberately deprived’ themselves of assets, they have the power to claim care costs from the person that the assets were transferred to.
Legally, local authorities have the power to recover costs by instituting County Court proceedings. However, a local authority should only do this after it has tried other reasonable alternatives to recover the debt.
Your right to appeal
The council’s decision must be reasonable and there is a right of appeal if you feel that an unfair decision has been made. If you want to make a complaint or appeal a decision, you should contact your local authority.
Seek legal advice
If you’re considering gifting any assets, particularly transfer of a property, you’ll need to seek legal advice to make sure it’s done properly. The Law Society has produced detailed guidelines for solicitors on gifts of property and their implications for long-term care. Make sure that any solicitor you speak to is aware of these guidelines.Book a family holiday to Los Vegas. say she lost the lot on the tables. Or tell her to sail round the world and have one last blow out, while being waited on hand and foot. She earnt it, she paid in the pot all her life, spend it.
That’s likely to fall under the deliberate deprivation scenario, and you can see what they think of that!!
Probably cheaper to book a trip to Switzerland and let inheritance tax take their cut – likely cheaper than the cost of care homes, and if I ever need one, it’s likely time to pull the plug. Like the Missus says ” I’ll live until I die, but if someone needs to wipe my ar$e, that’s not living!!”
An older (randy) American mate of mine looked at all the options open to him. These are strangely far fewer if US State/County tax is a consideration, and he decided just to up-sticks and live in Northern Thailand (Chiang Rai). He figured a live-in ‘maid’ plus cook was a lot cheaper than US care. Last I heard he was still going strong and had not run out of Viagra!
If I was seriously in that situation I’d pick Northern India (Simla area) as available medical services are first class, and simple care very cheap. The Japanese choose North Shore/Upper Hutt New Zealand for similar reasons but the economics are no longer attractive to us – thanks Brexit!
Viewing 10 posts - 1 through 10 (of 10 total)
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.
