Mint missing again

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This topic contains 76 replies, has 9 voices, and was last updated by Dave Rice 4 days, 5 hours ago.

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  • #31448

    Les.
    Participant
    @oldles

    Last night I thought “Not done a backup recently”. Booted up OK this morning, shut down OK. Went for ride on the bike as usual. Got home, switched on ready for some ‘bike vids, will not boot!

    Booted up with Mint 19 install disc and I could see the main drive, so connected up the backup drive. Apart from half a dozen .jpeg files (not .jpg files), everything copied to backup OK.

    Maybe it is my second 240GB SSD failing? How do I get it to boot again without wiping anything, or do I just put a spinner back in and reinstall Mint 19.x, and forget about these wonder solid state drives?

    Les.

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  • #31449

    The Duke
    Moderator
    @sgb101
    Forumite Points: 2,505

    You don’t half have soem bad luck Les, I’ve not had a single ssd go bad (touch wood), and my first was a 30gb job from 2007. It’s still in use today as a scratch disk on my kids pc.

    She uses it to record her online gaming onto, then copy’s back off to edit it down etc.. She fills it probably evey time she plays, which is 3 or 4 times a week. That old 30gb has had a hard life.

    Especally given its first job was the day w7 lanced to use it as thd c drive in my old thinkpad. Theat took up 22gb, leaving about 3gb spare to play with. I used an sd card as overflow storage. Also for s long time I also booted mint of the SD card.

    Sonce that ssd. I must of had 10 of them, keep enlarging as price drops. Never had an ssd issue. Tho I’ve only ever had one hdd issue, and that was user error, dropping the wife’s dell 1535(iirc)in about 2006/7.

    Now thumb drives, they all seem to die for me!

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    #31450

    Ed P
    Participant
    @edps
    Forumite Points: 3,352

    That is not an SSD failure. If it was you would get nada.

    That sounds to me like a failure in the file partition table, probably caused by someone pulling the plug on the PC instead of shutting down properly. Linux uses write-behind technology to speed up file responsiveness, but it does need care during shutdowns.

    I would recommend you clean up your file structures from time to time. I leave you to learn how to access and use fsck in root. (a bit fiddly as you have to umount your file system.

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    #31453

    Dave Rice
    Moderator
    @ricedg
    Forumite Points: 2,126

    Yep, when they go they go good and proper. The very first Corsair Nova 60GB I bought has just failed, probably 5 years old? At the same time a 2 / 3 year old Toshiba 240GB went west but apart from that they are all still going.

    Last month I inherited a 10 year old 1TB WD Green from an HP PC a customer was scrapping for a new Ryzen. It has been in use probably every day. I put it through all the WD tests and had EaseUs Partition manager do a bad sector check. 5 hours later not one in sight!

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    #31455

    Richard
    Participant
    @sawboman
    Forumite Points: 2,087

    I agree that the SSD is not the issue. They fail hard. While I agree with ED that power cycling the wrong way could affect the OS, I have also had a problem when other parts of the PC, e.g. the memory start to go off. That caused one machine a number of issues and in the end that took the SSD down, it became a ‘no drive’ machine as Dave said. Is there any option to force a buffer flush before shut down and thus avoid the issue that ED spoke about?

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    #31457

    Les.
    Participant
    @oldles
    Forumite Points: 497

    Actually, my previous SSD failure was a bit similar, but first I must say that after about 3 hrs use of the Pi, I just re-booted and it fired up OK?????

    I had a 60GB SSD off Dave 1 (or was it 2) years ago, that is still OK, in the other (my original) shuttle. My previous 240GB SSD caused a series of inexplicable shutdowns which had me replacing monitor,  graphics card, then suspecting the mother board or PSU. I bought a nearly identical shuttle at a good price (slightly faster and Watts-hungrier micom) to then discover it was the SSD when it failed to boot. I managed to recover much of the data when I finally mounted it under the newly installed Mint on the “faster” shuttle.

    It has not had any improper shutdown in the last couple of weeks, though before that it may have required a forced shutdown due to a non-responsive Kodi.

    So I must learn to use FSCK must I? Or is it going to sort itself out with a couple of proper shutdowns (such as it DID have this morning)?

    I am NOT optimistic about it not being a failing SSD.

    Les.

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    #31460

    Dave Rice
    Moderator
    @ricedg
    Forumite Points: 2,126

    As Ed says it does sound like the file system screwing up. SSDs don’t suffer from the physical problems that spinners do, like bad sectors or failing bearings, head crashes etc. that cause “local” problems in certain areas. But like spinners when the electronics fail they die totally.

    If the SSD can be partitioned or formatted it’s physically OK. I think I still have your address on the workshop PC, I’ll send you a bootable USB with EaseUs Partition Master on it, it may give you some insights. It’s based on WinPe but goes straight into the app… eventually 😉

    I must admit that in my recent return to Linux (mostly servers with no GUI)  I’ve more or less settled on Ubuntu as that has the best support. I know the default desktop is a bit naff but it’s just a means to an end – launching apps. It’s being able to get answers to problems and How To’s that work that’s swung it.

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    #31463

    Les.
    Participant
    @oldles
    Forumite Points: 497

    Dave, thanks for that offer. Way back at 10.2, I found Ubuntu a great move from Windoze, but when I had to move on at end of support,  I could not make any sense of the 12.x, tried some others, then after all the Mint talk on the other forum, tried that and stayed put. I have learned quite a bit, but there are still gaping holes in my knowledge, and I can never allocate the time to study. Too much to do for SWMBO, building jobs, and of course the motorbikes. If it is a faulty SSD, as I suspect, I will try a different one. This, like the other is a well known make (Kingston or Corsair I think) and it would be stupid to assume another one would not go the same way.

    But maybe it is just screwed file structure. We shall see.

    Les.

    • This reply was modified 3 months, 1 week ago by Les.. Reason: sp, We instead of W
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    #31468

    Ed P
    Participant
    @edps
    Forumite Points: 3,352

    When it ‘failed’ did it drop you into a command line sequence? You can get to a similar place if you hold down shift while booting. This (Single User Mode) has all the tools you need to do fsck etc. (it says Ubuntu but Mint just pinched these low level operation.

    linky to instructions

    • This reply was modified 3 months, 1 week ago by Ed P.
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    #31474

    Les.
    Participant
    @oldles
    Forumite Points: 497

    Ed, it simply failed to boot, and moved straight on to looking for boot from CDROM.

    I tried a couple of times with same result so stuck in my 19.1 install DVD. From that DVD and Ram OS, I could see the SSD, so connected up one of my backup drives to secure my data. I shut down and fired up the stand alone Pi with Kodi to watch the ‘bikes. After that, I tried again and it just worked. Not shut down since. Thanks for your link. I have an idea I can get a similar screen from the 19.1 install disc. Will investigate tomorrow.

    Thanks, Les.

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    #31485

    Ed P
    Participant
    @edps
    Forumite Points: 3,352

    Ok It could not find the grub boot partition. If you still have it in that state try following the instructions I referenced.

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    #31491

    RSB
    Keymaster
    @bdthree
    Forumite Points: 1,349

    One way you could go about things is if poss put the drive in another pc and remove the previous 3 boatloaders from the file system. I’ve had to do this a few times but 1. mainly servers and 2. It’s been a while and my brain is cabaged tonight. So do as earch. I have known Linux installs fill there belly on updated grub booot loaders and not delete the older, older, older ones. This can also create failed updates as there is not enough room. But now I am of on a tangent. These are a lot of experience I have had with forumites servers.

    Americans: Over Sexed, Over Payed and Over here, Wat Wat!

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    #31492

    D-Dan
    Participant
    @d-dan
    Forumite Points: 1,172

    Have you tried the most basic troubleshooting? e.g. Puit a live image on a thumb drive (I recommend etcher for this) and then boot from that. Assuming a Linux image, do a sudo fdisk -l and sudo blkid to make sure that the disk is recognised, then mount in the live environment, and see what’s there. If all seems OK, you can chroot into the “dead” system to fix it.

    Ryzen 7 1800X, 16 GB, 6 (yes - 6) HDs inc 2 SSDs, 4 RPis - one as an NFS server with two more drives, PiHole (shut yours), Plex server, cloud server, and other random Pi stuff. Nice CoolerMaster case, NV GTX 1060 6GB, and a whopping 32" AOC 1440P monitor.

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    #31500

    Les.
    Participant
    @oldles
    Forumite Points: 497

    After Saturday’s difficulties, I kept it on all the rest of the day, shutting down before bed.

    Yesterday, it booted OK, so again left on all day, and this morning it has booted OK once more.

    I think I will sit quietly until (if) it plays up again. I will then pull out No.2 pc for use, and try to troubleshoot this one at my leisure.

    D.Dan, to recap, if failed to boot 2 or 3 times Sat morning. I inserted a Mint install disc and that ran OK, and from that state I was able to see the SSD boot drive, and do an emergency backup of all my stuff.

    I then used the Pi and monitor for viewing the MotoGP Practice. Later I tried again and it booted correctly.

    Other than the loading of the Mint disc (but NOT re-install of course), it has behaved. After all the run around that slowly dying SDD gave me last year, I am being cautious.

    I have noted all the advice (Ed, RSB and D.D) ready for a repeat if / when it occurs.

    Thanks all. Les.

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    #31503

    Les.
    Participant
    @oldles
    Forumite Points: 497

    Just thinking about RSB’s comments. I have not had any forced shutdowns for at least a couple of weeks, but there were occasional ones before that caused by a Kodi freeze up when told to shut (Kodi) down. Might this have “stuffed up” the grub loader?

    OK, I have never looked at the bootloader before, time to look I guess. Get ready for sparks. Les.

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    #31511

    Ed P
    Participant
    @edps
    Forumite Points: 3,352

    The symptoms do not entirely match what Lee suggested, but he is quite correct kernel updates take a heap of spece and cause problems.

    I always use this scary script (use sudo to launch) every couple of months to clean up. Sorry I cannot attribute an author despite its usefulness.

    dpkg –list | grep linux-image | awk ‘{ print $2 }’ | sort -V | sed -n ‘/’uname -r‘/q;p’ | xargs sudo apt-get -y purge

    Copy and paste it into the text editor then save it as something like kernelclean.sh

    • This reply was modified 3 months, 1 week ago by Ed P.
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    #31525

    Tippon
    Keymaster
    @tippon
    Forumite Points: 1,684

    caused by a Kodi freeze up when told to shut (Kodi) down.

    As an aside, don’t try to exit Kodi while it’s scanning for new items. I’ve found that this almost always causes either a lock up or a crash, especially on an Android based system. Either wait for it to finish, or cancel the scan.

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    #31563

    Les.
    Participant
    @oldles
    Forumite Points: 497

    30 mins typing just lost. Try from “Writer” this time.

    First, Tippon, noted, but I don’t think I have done that for a long time. Only use Pi and PC for Kodi.

    This morning the PC refused to boot, but, unlike Saturday, this time there WAS recognition of an SSD present. Here is the sequence as best as I could write it down. Sometime it changed before copied.

    Error. Attempt to read or write to outside of HD0

    Entering rescue mode

    Grub rescue _ No obvious activity, eventually I hit enter

    Grub rescue _ As above, but eventually I hit Ctrl-Alt-Del

    A few lines of (SMALLER) text beginning:-

    Error. Read or write to HD0

    Needs Kernel rescue Little activity, then

    (A) Linux Mint Cinnamon etc

    (B) Advance options etc

    (C) Memtest 64+

    (D) Memtest 64+ (Serial controller 11500)

    try:- (C) Blank screen, eventually LED shows some SSD activity Returns to previous menu

    Try (D) Error. Read or write to HD0, then return to menu

    Try (A) Initial little activity, then (miss a bit) then Failure to read or write to HD0 then return to menu

    Try (B) (in ignorance of course)

    Linux Mint Cinnamon bla bla 4.15.0.46

    Linux Mint Cinnamon bla bla Recovery 4.15.0.46

    Ditto 45

    Ditto 43

    Ditto 20

    I Try 43

    Error failure to write etc press any key but then previous choices appear

    Try 44, same result.

    Force Shutdown with OFF button.

    Seems to start, shows the A,B,C and D menu, then a visual mint icon, and eventually an apparently normal start up. And here we are!

    Can you (DD, Edp, RSB, DR understand that lot?

    I just suggests to me either SSD failure, or your general suggestion of faulty Grub, but “I Know Nuffink”.

    Cheers, Les.

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    #31568

    Ed P
    Participant
    @edps
    Forumite Points: 3,352

    OK as the saying goes read the RTFM or in this case the Linky I posted earlier in the thread.

    You basically need to start in B) Advanced options.

    Just work through all the options one by one in turn, and WAIT until it completes (if more than ten minutes use ctrl–C), repeat until each section is completed. In your case ensure you do not miss out Grub.

    You should skip the options netroot and root as these would just be plain dangerous for your use, and finish once you have cleaned grub.

    [edit] – you are too quick to throw away good money – the SSD is fine. When a SSD fails it is as responsive as a brick. If you want reassurance run a SMART test on it, once you have got the OS back up.Once you have it cleaned up it may be time for you to check if you are using some funky software that is playing low level games in your system. Check the web for reports of bad behaviour with Ubuntu or Mint.

     

    • This reply was modified 3 months ago by Ed P.
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    #31574

    Les.
    Participant
    @oldles
    Forumite Points: 497

    EDp, cheers. Of course I did not have the link available at the time. However I have now printed out all of this thread AND the Ubuntu page you cited. I am off out in a few mins for Tamara’s dental appt., so maybe it will kick off again this evening, when I may have a chance to achieve something. Thanks, Les.

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    #31575

    Ed P
    Participant
    @edps
    Forumite Points: 3,352

    Once you have it all cleared up You need to find out WHY it keeps crapping out as Linux has a very stable file system

    a) Do you get the occasional messages that make no sense about you running out of disk space, and you ignore them as it appears you have plenty. This is the bug that Lee highlighted. root can run out of space despite their being plenty elsewhere. This can screw up your drives. Use the script I posed earlier to fix.

    b) If a) raises no Red Flags then one of your F1 watching programs may have a memory bug that allows it to write where it shouldn’t. As Dan will say ‘This cannot happen’ but you need to check your Kodi forums to see if others have issues.

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